Interview: Chris Vandalay & Dave Franco
Two Long-Time Musical Collaborators Discuss Chicago Power Pop
Chicago is a holy place for fans of power pop.
Since the ‘70s, the Windy City has been a launching pad for legendary Illinois acts like Cheap Trick, Shoes, Pezband, Off Broadway, Material Issue and many others—including several great bands formed around the 40+ year musical partnership between between Chris Vandalay (aka Chris Cerasoli) and drummer Dave Franco.
“There were so many places you could play (in the ‘70s and ‘80s). Not corner bars, but clubs. Big stages and sound. Literally, you could play a different place every night—two, sometimes three bands and all original music,” Franco told me for the interview below.
Franco and Vandalay first made a splash with the mid-‘80s electro pop/new wave quartet Oh Boy! That band released the successful single “Some Things (You Don’t Understand),” but a deal with DJ International didn’t pan out and the band soon split.
There next collaboration was with the power pop/garage rock band The Quick (no connection to the ‘70s LA band of the same name, which still causes some confusion on streaming services). The Quick released two excellent EPs—Alternative…To What? (1995) and Mr. Dee-lish (1998), before calling it quits.
Activity picked up again in the new Millennium.
Vandalay and Franco formed/joined two more talented power pop bands—The Vandalays in the 2000s, followed by Too Much Saturn in in the 2010s. Most recently, Vandalay and Franco worked together on the song “Better Than Before” as The chrisVandalay Project.
“I’ve always trusted Dave’s ability to interpret my songs from a drumming perspective, which is why he played drums on the track. In general, he knows how not to overplay while still being creative; understands where his parts fit; is a good friend, and there’s never any ego-drama—which I’ve always appreciated,” Vandalay said.
I caught up with two longtime friends and musical collaborators by email—Vandalay in South Carolina, and Franco in Illinois—to discuss their impressive musical history together, and to get their perspective on the legendary Chicago power pop scene.
Chris Vandalay and Dave Franco Interview
You guys came of age during Chicago's golden era of power pop. Who were some of your favorite bands from that scene growing up?
Dave Franco: The big guns were The Kind and a band called Take Me. Off Broadway and Pezband were starting to distance themselves from the pack. Shoes not far behind. Kevin Lee and Heartbeat were also another strong showing. Kevin is still making great records and still playing out.
Chris Vandalay: In the Chicago scene there was a lot of Cheap Trick (especially during their first 2 records). Growing up in the Chicago area, we were fortunate to have a vibrant music club scene, which afforded me opportunities to see them pretty early-on in clubs like Luigi’s and Haymakers. Then, it was Shoes, The Kind, Pezband, Hugh Hart’s The Odd had their moments, Loose Lips, a band called Take Me (who I loved and thought should have hit it big), The Elvis Brothers (who Oh Boy! opened for a bunch), then of course, Off Broadway. We also opened for Alejandro Escovedo’s old band Rank and File at Haymakers in suburban Chicago. They were super-cool and really good!
You were power pop fans, but your first band Oh Boy! was more of an electro-pop/new wave act. What inspired that stylistic direction?
Chris Vandalay: The short answer is, our manager pushed us to move more in that direction. She was trying to leverage “Some Things (You Don’t Understand)”—that we had done for AEMPP Records—with major labels, and a lot of them were really nosing around Chicago at that time. At the same time, the record was getting a good amount of attention in the large Chicago market including airplay on mega-major market WLS-FM radio, and DJs were playing it a ton in dance clubs.
Preceding that, though, the “Some Things” recording process became more electro pop/new wave-like, in part, because the chief engineer at CRC Studios was Larry Sturm, who had recently had major success with Ministry (before they were industrial), and he had become pretty influential in the industry. The other main piece to this was that my songwriting approach has always been melody first. Plus, it seemed to me that at times the lines could be a little blurry between power pop and new wave, and both genres matched my melody/hook-first approach.
In the end, it made sense to us to take advantage of the opportunities in front of us, and sort of ride the wave, and—if we were gonna ride that wave—there had to be more Oh Boy! material conducive to being shopped to the major labels, matching what they were looking for at the time. Near the end of Oh Boy!’s run we ended up signing with Rocky Jone’s Chicago House label DJ International. They were looking to diversify into the more new wave/alternative genre. We did record a song in their studios before the experiment was abandoned.
Dave Franco: We had some really poppy tunes such as “Suzanne” and “Tonight and Don’t Come Cryin’.” It worked out. We were nominated for a Grammy, but ultimately it was Chris’ music that led us at that time and through the decades!
Your next band The Quick was more of a power pop/garage rock band. What was the Chicago scene like when that band got rolling?
Chris Vandalay: At that time, it felt like the music scene in Chicago was starting to diversify a bit. Power pop was still alive, as Off Broadway became the Cliff Johnson-led Black and Blonde (who we opened for a number of times) and Material Issue was on the rise—which helped give power pop another boost—but the “grunge/alternative-effect” was also wielding it’s influence with local-ish bands like Veruca Salt, and the more glam-alternative Urge Overkill (The Quick rehearsed at the same facility as UO, located in a very dicey area). We were all playing clubs like Avalon (formerly Tuts), Beat Kitchen, Elbow Room, Abbey Pub and Cubby Bear.
The grunge/Nirvana thing also spawned the popularity of the “unplugged” concept, which The Quick sometimes incorporated into some of our live shows at clubs like At The Tracks, The Emerald Isle and my wedding. That trend, along with a couple of radio stations playing our track “He Said, She Said” off of our Alternative… To What? EP also gave us the opportunity to do a few live unplugged performances on Chicago radio stations like Q101 and WCBR.
In fact, when we did WCBR, a new band called Counting Crows (“Mr, Jones” had just dropped) was waiting on the other side of the radio studio glass, watching as they waited to go on after us.
Speaking of the scene diversifying—weirdly, The Quick also once ended up opening for REO Speedwagon at an outdoor fest in suburban Chicago…
Dave Franco: Things were changing for sure. Not as many places to play. Original music was getting squeezed for cover and tribute bands. Interesting that the old scene players actually all continued playing as different permutations. Black and Blonde from Off Broadway, Brad Elvis from the Elvis Brothers to Big Hello. We played with all of them. All very nice people, I might add. Cliff was great. He had “it.” He was like a big brother. Whenever we saw him, there was back-slapping and “How are you guys doing?” I believe he also respected us knowing we had all “served our time” together on that circuit. So sorry he is gone.
With The Quick, we continued following Chris, our muse. We put together a three-song ‘maxi-single,’ as we labeled it, for marketing purposes. Sent a million copies out to writers and labels. Out of nowhere, we got a half-page write-up in the Chicago Sun-Times by Jim DeRogatis—who is a power pop geek. This corresponded with us playing a summer of Chicago festivals, which would never happen now as an original band.
Memorable gig? I was part of Dennis Rodman’s security team. Dennis is a really sweet person once you get past all the nonsense. He came to see The Vandalays play at a small club after a Bulls game, not anywhere close to downtown Chicago, which meant a lot to me. He came up on stage with a tray of Kamikazes and did a shot with us while we were playing!
Listening to your first release Alternative...To What? I'm reminded of bands like Cheap Trick, Off Broadway! and Material Issue. Who were some of your major influences?
Chris Vandalay: My songwriting continued to be influenced by 20/20 (my favorite power pop band to this day), Paul Collins Beat, Tommy Keene, earlier Cheap Trick, and also Neil Finn. I was thrilled when Gin Blossoms became popular, but then I also started to become a little more attracted to some roots-rock/alt-type bands, too like The Jayhawks, Toad The Wet Sprocket, and even The Wallflowers, largely because of the quality of their songwriting and melodies. Again, for me it has always been about melody and hooks.
Dave Franco: I think the ‘influences’ question is something that interviewers use as an attempt to understand the artists hoping for some divine enlightenment. I just play the drums and hope that what I play can make the music the way Chris hears it in his mind. Honestly, I never owned a Cheap Trick record. Saw Off Broadway many times and also played with them on several bills. But consciously playing like them? I don’t think we ever did. Material Issue? When we were barnstorming Somethings, Jim Ellison was writing for his college paper. He interviewed Oh Boy! and seemed a bit star-struck. We later played a few dates with MI. He watched us play intently. Almost like studying us. If anything I believe we influenced them.
My epiphany occurred when I heard The Who’s ‘I Can See For Miles.’ I never listened to music again in a pedestrian manner. Rather than ‘influence,’ what I will say is there are certain artists that are special to me. The Who, of course. Townshend coined the phrase power pop. He also wrote the quintessential power pop song, ‘The Kids Are Alright.’
The most significant artist for me is Tommy Keene. I believe that Tommy was the most important artist in our time. ‘Back To Zero Now’ is a power pop masterpiece. After he died I could not bring myself to listen to any of his music for over a year. I have just now started to bring him back into my life.
Can we talk about drumming influences? Stan Lynch, Ian Paice, Brian Downey, and Keith Moon are on my Mt. Rushmore. Consciously trying to emulate would be John Richardson—who I’ve become friends with over the years—played with Tommy. Also did the last Gin Blossoms and Shoes records (check out Ignition—it’s excellent!) But as I said earlier, I just play what I feel. Must be in our DNA, Coulter! [Editor’s note: S.W. Lauden is my nom de plume; Steve Coulter is my nom de drum.]
Is it true that you worked with Jeff Murphy from Shoes on your EP Mr. Dee-lish?
Chris: Yep! 100% true. We were excited that Jeff took us on and we recorded at Jeff’s Short Order Recorders in Zion, IL—a tiny studio on the corner, which is where a lot of Shoes records were done. Jeff was great to work with, He was kind of demanding, in a good way, and a good guy. Interestingly, I remember that he played us a few cuts that Tommy Keene had recently come in and recorded. They sounded great to us, but I remember Jeff saying that he thought Tommy was not gonna end up using the tracks and that he was “very specific about what he wanted” …Tommy did not use the tracks.
The best part for us, though was that, aside from producing/engineering), Jeff also added background vocals to our ‘Caroline Is Crying,’ which is on Mr. Dee-lish.
Dave Franco: Jeff was such a sweet guy. He was great. Partly I think because we shared the same slog of playing every chance we got everywhere we could. I also remember the stories Jeff told. Here’s one: Shoes got signed and went to England to play. They were all in the van headed somewhere. They wanted to drive by Abbey Road. On their way there, Jeff was looking out the back window of the van and Paul McCartney was pulling into Abbey Road.
What I also remember was Jeff loving music, but also loving the creative process of music. It was like he was a band member. Which he de facto was since sang background vocals on the record.
After The Quick, you two went on to form The Vandalays. Did you see that as a continuation of what you'd started in The Quick?
Chris Vandalay: No, it wasn’t a continuation. Our bass player Mile Okumura had moved back to Hawaii, and our guitar player Ken Valskis was dealing with some life issues, so The Quick basically ended.
After a bit of a break, Dave and I started talking about doing something again, and that led to The Vandalays concept and plan—basically a fresh start. To Dave’s credit, he really sort of pushed me and I ended up getting into a songwriting groove that resulted in our first record, the concept album (re)Begin. I had always wanted to write a concept album and this one was sort of reflective of where I/we were in life, I guess.
We ended up connecting with a promo company that specialized in college radio. They were pivotal in getting us a significant amount of airplay. In fact, the lead single from the record, ‘Can’t Find Your Way,’ got airplay on 250 college stations across the U.S. and Canada!
We ended up bringing a new bass player, Tim Gleason, on board, our guitar player became more available, and we started gigging—starting with doing David Bash’s International Pop Overthrow in Chicago at Wise Fool’s Pub. Over the next few years, we played at Chicago clubs like Double Door (we opened for Enuff Z’Nuff there), played Beat Kitchen a lot, and The Elbow Room.
We ended up back in the studio again, which resulted in the Happy After Ever record, which included ‘Tracy,’ one of my favorite pure power pop tunes that I’ve written. Unfortunately, not long after, our bass player left to pursue his own thing and our guitar player had to again deal with some personal issues, and that basically ended The Vandalays.
One historical footnote: Just before The Vandalays officially ended we had recorded the first song that was to be the start of our third record, On We Go. It sat unreleased until we heard that Ray Gianchetti’s Kool Kat Musik label was going to do a charity record to benefit The World Central Kitchen, as they were aiding Ukraine. Seemed to me to be the perfect way to finally release ‘On We Go,’ so we did as part of the Pop Aid – Ukraine compilation record!
Dave Franco: I think the continuation was organic. I never wanted to stop playing and Chris had more songs. We just kept moving forward musically. The Vandalays were maybe a bit different than The Quick, but it was Chris and his music again leading the way. Check out Happy After Ever, I think it’s our best power pop effort even though (re) Begin got a ton of college radio play and was album of the year at Wilkes Barre University.
Your next band, Too Much Saturn really feels like a culmination of all your experience as Chicago power pop veterans. What was the Chicago scene like by the 2010s?
Chris Vandalay: I actually joined TMS later, after Dave had. The dynamic was very different for me since I was initially joining a band, as basically a keyboard player, that already had a lead singer/songwriter. I struggled a bit with not being the sole creative force, only lead singer, although as time went on, Mark Hoffman (lead singer/songwriter) did welcome my songwriting contributions until we became a dual lead singer/songwriter band.
The band was a bit more musically polished, with good musicianship and we produced some good stuff, right up to the end of TMS’s run, with two final singles released in 2022 right before I moved to Greenville, SC—my ‘Life On Repeat’ and Mark’s ‘Stop Thief.’
The Chicago club scene had definitely changed, as 2011 rolled around. There seemed to less straight-up original music clubs, although we did play places like The Montrose Saloon, The Red Line Tap, Live Wire’s and Sylvie’s.
The trend started to be smaller ‘corner taverns’ jumping in and offering live music (original and cover bands), which is somewhat similar now in the Greenville SC/Asheville, NC area—although here it’s more micro-breweries.
Dave Franco: TMS had a good run. I think Chris’ songwriting became a bit more pensive. ‘After Glo’ seems a preview of what was coming with The chrisVandalay Project’ s ‘Better Than Before.’ Chris also wrote a very important song, ‘Shake Someone,’ a cautionary tale of global warming. We did have some poppy stuff too. ‘All His Way,’ ‘I Don’t Wanna Say’ and ‘Stop Thief,’ which Mark Hoffmann wrote. I think you may dig those tunes.
The scene was/is dead I think. Cover and tribute bands rule the day. Literally, only three places for original bands to play. I had friends The Stanleys—from Australia— who wanted to come up to Chicago and tour their great EP. I tried to deter them, to no avail. I told them, ‘You don’t get famous in Chicago. You get famous elsewhere then come back and you’re magically great.’
Most recently, you guys released The chrisVandalay Project track "Better Than Before." How would you describe your musical relationship after four-plus decades playing together?
Dave Franco: Putting it that way makes it sound scary—four-plus decades! But it’s so natural to me. You know too that having gone through the musical gauntlet with someone creates an attachment like no other. ‘Better Than Before’ was actually pretty seamless. A unique pre-production for us because we are in different parts of the country, but that’s more normal than ever now. We essentially worked the song out as we normally would have except over the phone and computer vs. looking and listening at rehearsal. I think it kills and Gavin Glover did a spectacular job with the production. Getting lots of airplay too!
Musically, I have always moved forward with Chris as the lead. After 40 years, I don’t anticipate stopping playing or creating. Quite honestly, I am excited for the next chrisVandalay Project record!
Chris Vandalay: Chris: After I moved to Greenville, South Carolina, I started doing singer/songwriter gigs, trying to immerse myself into the live/original music scene in the area—which is very songwriter-heavy!
I eventually connected with Drew Montgomery, a really good singer/songwriter who was putting together an original indie rock/Britpop band, Kick.Snare.Crash. I’m their keyboard player now and we’re gigging around South Carolina, North Carolina and Tennessee—it’s more of a “regional” music scene here.
However, I continued to write and demo my own songs with The chrisVandalay Project/solo project in mind. I bounced newly-demoed songs off of Dave, leading up to writing/demoing ‘Better Than Before.’ From a songwriter perspective, I kinda felt like I had ‘something’ with that song and decided to go into Trigger Point Productions studio with a very talented producer named Gavin Glover to record it as the first single.
There are a ton of very talented musicians in this area, which enabled me to have Drew Montgomery play guitars on the track, with Gavin Glover also playing bass and ROLI Seaboard, (an unusual midi-computer/synth-type instrument), with Dave recording/adding his drum track remotely.
‘Better Than Before’ was released about two months ago, and seems to be pretty well-received, so far—especially by indie and college radio stations, and the lyric video on my chrisVandalay Youtube channel is gaining some traction. Now, the plan is to go back into the studio to record 3 or 4 more songs to be released with “Better” as an EP.
The third volume of our semi-annual music journal features some of today's best music writers and the most talented modern musicians:
Carl Cafarelli on Ramones
Jordan Oakes in Conversation with Paul Collins (The Nerves/The Beat)
Rich Tupica on Big Star's Radio City
Mary E. Donnelly in Conversation with Stina Tweeddale (Honeyblood)
Blue Broderick on The Apples in Stereo
Kevin Alexander on The Yellow Melodies
Dan Epstein on Redd Kross
Jim Ruland on The Last
James Harding on New Zealand Guitar Pop
S.W. Lauden on Weezer